TdB
Free Scholar
Posts:58
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| 05/09/2007 12:15 PM |
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What are folks using for cut and thrust gloves? I'm way over-armored for C&T everywhere but the hands and head. I've had no luck finding a decent pair of C&T gloves, and my sidesword hilts aren't particularly good protection on their own.
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OK, fine, I'm unapproachable. Keep your distance or I'll pez you. |
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Alvarro
Too many posts...
Posts:301
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| 05/10/2007 8:32 AM |
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I'm not using any...the way the rules are written I can't find *suitable* hand protection that fits with the swords I use, the way they are supposed to be used, so I only do "cut and thrust" outside the SCA.
And I don't bother with, or require, hand protection there. I *reccomend* it, but don't require it.
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Prudence. Temperance. Fortitude. Justice. |
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TdB
Free Scholar
Posts:58
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| 05/11/2007 10:00 AM |
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I unintentionally parry with my knuckles all too often to forgo hand protection. I need something I can use with longsword as well as sidesword / arming sword.
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OK, fine, I'm unapproachable. Keep your distance or I'll pez you. |
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jgreywolf
Hai Gioco?
Posts:685
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| 05/11/2007 1:08 PM |
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Prospere has reported some success with lacrosse gloves, if memory serves. I have been working with a bunch of different armor merchants to see how many different options I can find.
For those of us that depends on our hands for a living, not sure it would be advisable to change this requirement.  The question becomes - what is more important to coer, the bones of the wrist, or the knuckles?
And which requirement is causing more of an issue in finding adequate protection? Wrists or knuckles? |
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Justin Greywolf (SCA: Ramon Diaz de la Vega)
Director
Old World Martial Arts - Teaching Historical Italian Swordplay in the Pacific Northwest |
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TdB
Free Scholar
Posts:58
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| 05/11/2007 1:15 PM |
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I wear full forearm protection because Lichtenauer and those who followed after favor the arms as a target second only to the head, and I've discovered it's uncomfortable to have a longsword dropped across my forearms. I'll have to see if I can find a pair of lacrosse gloves that flare enough to go around my forearm protection, or a pair that I can modify to do so...
Edit: I've picked up a pair that will work - barely. The finger protection on all the pairs I looked at was really bulky. I can barely get my gloved hand inside the guard of my sidesword. Works better for my longsword. I've got a nice overlap of the forearm protection with the gloves, too.. the gloves flare out enough so that they don't cause a problem. I would definately prefer something a little less bulky, though.
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OK, fine, I'm unapproachable. Keep your distance or I'll pez you. |
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Alvarro
Too many posts...
Posts:301
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| 05/11/2007 5:11 PM |
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For longsword, I ordered a lovely pair of steel mitten gauntlets. Only way to go.
When I'm fighting with the hanwei mortuary hilt swords (which really need to be added back to the approved list) I only wear elbow protection. Sometimes. Once you are used to the pace, and are fighting trained people, the sword really does most of the protection.
When I'm using a rapier (again, not in the SCA...our rules never distinguished between types of cuts, and we are used to a heavier impact) I just wear my regular gloves, as do most of the students. The occasional person wears motorcycle gloves with trauma plates across the knuckles.
Prospere use lacrosse gloves for longsword. He's looking to upgrade.
The chief issue I find with the C&T rules as written is not wrists or knuckles, but fingers. Rigid finger protection really just gets in the way. I think people that are excessively worried should protect their fingers (or just not do a combat sport, really...), but the rest of us should be free to take our chances. Wrist protection via a demi-gauntlet should be more than enough for most people.
Again, we've been doing this three years now, no serious injuries.
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Prudence. Temperance. Fortitude. Justice. |
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jgreywolf
Hai Gioco?
Posts:685
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| 05/16/2007 4:42 PM |
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Remember that the hilt of your sword can provide some (if not all) of the protection for your fingers. Since the protection is only intended for cuts, and not thrusts, any kind of "basket" hilt would work. Then demi gauntlets for the wrist, as you say.
I do not know that the Hanwei Mortuary Hilt was EVER in the rules. According to the Society Level rules for the Sidesword Experiment the only Hanwei blades allowed were the following (see http://jan.ucc.nau.edu/~wew/fencing/sca/sca-sidesword.html):
-- 37" Hanwei Blades
-- Hanwei "renblades"
I have no idea what the Hanwei "renblades" are - since there has been no such beast in their catalog (at least as of Jan 2005) |
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Justin Greywolf (SCA: Ramon Diaz de la Vega)
Director
Old World Martial Arts - Teaching Historical Italian Swordplay in the Pacific Northwest |
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Alvarro
Too many posts...
Posts:301
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| 05/17/2007 10:16 PM |
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Ramon,
The mortuary hilt was part of the Backsword subset of sidesword...don't tell me that has just been forgotten in the shuffle.....
Regarding hilts:
As was explained to me, you need full finger protection (rigid gauntlets) is you are using a hanwei practical rapier hilt. This, to me, seems excessive.
Actually, even requiring forearm and wrist protection seems excessive to me, since you clearly stated in the the 12th night marshallate meeting that blow calling and level of force should be identical between rapier and sidesword.
Do we need rigid finger protection for regular rapier now?
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Prudence. Temperance. Fortitude. Justice. |
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jgreywolf
Hai Gioco?
Posts:685
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| 05/20/2007 8:31 PM |
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Rigid forarm protection is NOT required. And I would have to disagree that protecting the wrists is excessive. Not that I have the presence of mind to clarify that more at the moment...
Question - why were no concersn regarding the armor requirements brought up earlier? All of this was in the draft rules at least as early as September 2006. I do not remember any big conversations on these items offhand... |
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Justin Greywolf (SCA: Ramon Diaz de la Vega)
Director
Old World Martial Arts - Teaching Historical Italian Swordplay in the Pacific Northwest |
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warwick
Provost
Posts:124
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| 05/21/2007 12:32 AM |
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Hi Justin - I would hazard to guess that people did not spend a enough time combingthrough the ruleset to find items that might be problematic in terms of armour.
But I'm thinking we may be over-thinking what is required. What are the chances of a gallery of pictures that show acceptable levels of protection? Multiple shots of adequate hand protection with a variety of guards - the same for wrists and forearms, etc. This would probably help a lot of people meet spec.
W
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KitH
Free Scholar
Posts:65
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| 11/05/2007 1:22 PM |
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Has anyone gotten a pair of the Light Sparring Gloves from Revival Martial Arts? http://www.revival.us/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=313&HS=1
Are they worthwhile and meet the requirements for An Tir?
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Kit Heinrichs
SCA: Christopher MacEveny, Cadet to Don Magnus von Bremen |
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Arffuidsson
Free Scholar
Posts:68
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| 11/24/2007 8:05 AM |
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Hello,
Here in the West I have used the Revival gloves for cut and thrust with no problems.
In Service,
Staffan Arffuidsson
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Estaban
Novice
Posts:1
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| 10/08/2008 12:48 PM |
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| Both Lucien and Callan use them in Lions Gate and have had no problems with them. |
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warwick
Provost
Posts:124
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| 10/10/2008 12:17 PM |
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| Callen wore his over steel bracers and the bracers popped the plates out the cuffs - Revival replaced the gloves no questions asked. |
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KitH
Free Scholar
Posts:65
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| 10/22/2008 1:26 PM |
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| Thanks. The gloves are currently on back order. |
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Kit Heinrichs
SCA: Christopher MacEveny, Cadet to Don Magnus von Bremen |
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